You Don't Need to Invent New Products. Just Do This.

It is AG1 in a gummy. All it is.

Sometimes you hear ideas and you're like, it's too easy. Of course, that works. They launched [music] 3 years

works. They launched [music] 3 years ago. I'm fairly confident it's 500

ago. I'm fairly confident it's 500 million in sales.

>> Oh my gosh, dude. That's a whole industry. 500 million in 3 years tells

industry. 500 million in 3 years tells me way more demand than supply.

>> Take something that's already really popular and just change the form factor and it'll crush. OxyClean has done 5 billion [music] plus in sales at this point. Big money industry. Very big

point. Big money industry. Very big

money. And so I think what you can do is try to figure out what are the other categories that you can put that in.

You're selling a very cheap thing for a pretty high markup because you're solving that embarrassment problem.

>> Yeah, that is an amazing idea. It's a

no-brainer.

[music] You may recognize Connor. He's been on the pod five or six times. He lives here in New York. So I flew to New York and sat down with him to talk business ideas. Please enjoy. So tell me what

ideas. Please enjoy. So tell me what you've been learning about Billy Mazize.

Man, Billy Mays, is he still alive?

>> No. RP Billy Mazize. Born out for Billy Mays. Yeah, this guy made billions

Mays. Yeah, this guy made billions basically. Long story short, you think

basically. Long story short, you think like the late night infomercial that maybe like people's crazy cousins or crazy uncles now watch these days, he was the king of it. And what I wanted to

come into today's conversation with was kind of understanding how he made so much money and like what the top products were. And like back then late

products were. And like back then late night infomercials were the way to sell products is how you moved moved volume.

Now it's TCO, now it's meta ads and like tik to tik tok search little geo stuff.

And so I was like, he's clearly selling stuff that people wanted to buy.

>> How do you sell it again in a way that is not on a TV and not using CTV because, you know, the audience for that has dwindled to a fraction of the size.

And so I started diving into some of the top sellers. And do do you know what his

top sellers. And do do you know what his top sellers are? Have you done any research here on this?

>> No. Was he the Flex Seal guy?

>> Yes. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. the the

well, we spray painted an entire boat.

It's like we put a screen door in the bottom of this canoe.

>> Like what a visual hook on that commercial.

>> It was classic direct response marketing like to the tea. And now I feel like you have all these e-commerce guys who are turning around and they're like we're doing 45 minute long VSSLs and like we are going after heavy hooks and all that

stuff and all they're doing is they're just taking the stuff that worked in direct response back in the 90s and early 2000s and they're just putting it on meta. And so what I thought was like

on meta. And so what I thought was like what were the categories and the products that somebody who was as iconic as Billy Mays was, what was he selling and how can you then apply that to

social media and sell it again? And so

you remember the Flex Seal. Flex Seal is iconic. Slap it on. It's like the

iconic. Slap it on. It's like the classic meme. But his number one

classic meme. But his number one product, any guesses? Do you know any categories?

>> I saw your tweet, so I'm going to act.

>> It's not that.

>> Oh, really? Okay. So your tweet was about Reptissery Chicken.

>> So that was not him, I don't think.

>> Oh, okay.

>> Yeah. I don't even remember his products. Like what? Let's do this.

products. Like what? Let's do this.

>> Yeah.

>> Tell me all of his products and I'll try to guess the more successful ones.

>> You're gonna know when I say it. So it's

it's OxyClean.

>> Oh, he was OxyClean.

>> He was OxyClean. Okay.

>> And OxyClean has done five billion plus in sales at this point. So like simple >> idea of what OxyClean is, stain remover.

Now they have it more in a spray. Before

it was like this little tub. You would

scoop out this powder. You put it on the shirt. You'd kind of like rub it in a

shirt. You'd kind of like rub it in a little bit and you toss the shirt in the wash. And so OxyClean was one of the top

wash. And so OxyClean was one of the top categories. You look at all of the other

categories. You look at all of the other products. It's bathroom cleaners. It's

products. It's bathroom cleaners. It's

like a glue that was remodeled to like fix up seams of jeans and like if your couch cushion split like it's a fabric uh sealant. You have like hardwood floor

uh sealant. You have like hardwood floor like cleaner stuff like that. So, it's

all home products, all consumables, and the type of thing that like has some unique level of form factor on it, and something that you are going to use time and time again once you build up that

habit. And so, I'm working with a lot of

habit. And so, I'm working with a lot of DC brands right now. I think you know this. And I'm seeing the best people

this. And I'm seeing the best people that are consistently crushing it today have very small tweaks on form factor and then very good direct response marketing. And so like classic example

marketing. And so like classic example that everyone's talking about in the news today is Grun. You know Grun's like the the vitamin gummy.

>> No, I don't.

>> You haven't seen them?

>> No. Grun.

>> Gru with like the little two dots on top. NS.

top. NS.

>> It is athletic greens. You know athletic greens.

>> Yeah. Yeah.

>> It's AG1.

>> AG1. It is AG1 in a gummy.

>> All it is.

>> Sometimes you hear ideas and you're like it's too easy. Of course that works.

They launched three years ago, which someone who's watching this on the internet is going to misquote or tell me the exact numbers. I'm fairly confident it's 500 million in sales. Three years

ago, >> just think if we were sitting here a thousand days ago.

>> Oh my gosh, dude. That's a whole industry. It's like XYZ in a gummy.

industry. It's like XYZ in a gummy.

Yeah, we saw confidence in a gummy. Y

>> we [laughter] what wouldn't work in a gummy? So, I

think this is where I think you can literally come up with a laundry list of ideas of things that would work is take something that's already really popular and just change the form factor. So, you

have this massive TAM novel version of doing it and then go direct response and it'll crush. The other example, also a

it'll crush. The other example, also a very big business. Have you heard of a company called Starface?

>> No.

>> Okay. Uh, you have a daughter, right?

>> Mhm.

>> How old is your daughter?

>> 13.

>> She'll probably start using Starface, too. I'm guessing it's like it is a

too. I'm guessing it's like it is a pimple patch thing. Have you seen this at all? No. No. So,

at all? No. No. So,

>> massive category, Proactive, Neutrogena, whatever. Like, all these skincare

whatever. Like, all these skincare brands for blemishes. Normally, that was how when I was growing up, you clean your face and I guess people still clean their face, whatever.

>> But now, if you have a pimple, you can have acne and it's on your face. The

trendy thing to do is get a sticker, a star, and you put it on your face >> like in public.

>> In public.

>> Wow. So like what Alex Hermosi is doing with his no strip?

>> That is perfect analogy. Yes. So like

before wearing a nose strip out in public. Weird thing to do.

public. Weird thing to do.

>> Nelly. Remember Nelly with a band-aid?

That was before your time.

>> Oh yeah. The rapper.

>> Would you just always wear a band-aid?

>> Yeah. I mean he only wore a band-aid for now. Nothing. That was his brand. He put

now. Nothing. That was his brand. He put

a band-aid right here.

>> Not even hiding like a little teardrop tattoo or anything? No.

>> That was just his trademark was the band-aid on the face.

>> So this is something that's trendy.

Starface big company. And they basically said people have acne. It's a big category. We're not gonna try to fix it

category. We're not gonna try to fix it at its root cause. We're going to try to give you a stylish way to hide it. And

so, I feel like the main idea that I came in here with that I've been I know I'm on short notice, so I try to spin up some stuff quickly >> was like with this OxyClean to bring it full circle.

>> It's a not great form factor. Now, they

have spray. So, I I will be the first to admit it's a slightly better form factor, but like they have the tie to go sticks. They have the spray.

sticks. They have the spray.

>> Do they do the magic erasers? Is that

OxyClean?

>> I don't know. They might. They probably

probably like one of these big unilver proctor types of brands at this point.

>> I'm thinking though, could you do this in a sticker? And I'm thinking like dad's wallets, mom's purses. You're out

to eat.

>> Rather than having, you know, something that's this big that's kind of like a wand or magic race or whatever. Can you

have something that like hides in your in your wallet, >> you pull it out, you peel it, you stick it on the stain, and it releases something instantly that just stays on the shirt? Believe it or not, just

the shirt? Believe it or not, just because you're watching this doesn't mean you're subscribed to my channel.

YouTube's going to show you stuff even if you're not subscribed to it. Over

half of people that watch my videos are not subscribed. It would mean the world

not subscribed. It would mean the world to me if you just hit subscribe. Thank

you so much.

>> Oh, okay. So, like a stain remover sticker.

>> Mhm.

>> Interesting.

>> And it can be different colors. You

know, obviously I'm assuming white's going to be the most popular to kind of blend in with the shirt or whatever. But

maybe there's something out there around like it has to stay on it longer, therefore the sticker is better or like you don't want to be walking around with a wet shirt or I don't know. Like do you want to be walking around with a sticker? I don't know. But if you can

sticker? I don't know. But if you can make it cool if it's like a little kid and he's getting food all over your stuff, you put a dinosaur sticker on and you know that's going to clean it.

>> So for clothes specifically, >> that's my thought to I think that makes more sense than like carpet >> definitely >> because there's not enough like surface area to I don't know. I'm thinking like you walk around though with like a Power Rang I don't know if Power Rangers are

still cool. Uh like dinosaur stickers,

still cool. Uh like dinosaur stickers, some kind of licensing, some Disney things, Pokemon, and next thing you know it's got like some kind of sticky residue on the outside with a cleaning

residue on the inside. Put it on a shirt. I think that could work really

shirt. I think that could work really well.

>> That is an amazing idea.

>> Nice. Sorry.

>> Because like first of all, it doesn't have to work all that well >> because that's not the problem you're solving. You're you're solving

solving. You're you're solving embarrassment. the parent kid doesn't

embarrassment. the parent kid doesn't care, right? If I'm out with my kids and

care, right? If I'm out with my kids and they get a big stain on their shirt and we're about to go somewhere nice, it is what it is. They're kids. But if I could have a solution to that problem, I would buy it. Yeah.

buy it. Yeah.

>> Right. And if I could know as a bonus, it's going to help that stain come out when you do throw it in the wash, it's a no-brainer. And it's consumable.

no-brainer. And it's consumable.

>> Mhm.

>> So, you buy more and more of them.

>> Buy a pack of them. You're selling a very cheap thing for a pretty high markup because you're solving that embarrassment problem.

>> Yeah. That's really interesting. I want

to know more about Starface. like do you know where what their founding story is or >> so I think the CEO does a lot of these beauty products and is has really good retail connections and so I think they've gone a little bit of a different

way rather than going traditionally DTOC but I know that they've scaled up fast in just a couple of years time and like I think culturally they've really defined a lot of stuff >> are they in stores or is it just >> yeah no I think it's like it's Ulta

targets all that all that stuff >> are boys wearing them >> I'm not wearing them >> but like is it a thing just for girls or are both genders wearing it >> I've seen guys wear them >> really. Even in your 20s, 30s, people

>> really. Even in your 20s, 30s, people wear them.

>> I think it's one of those things where like you're in a city like New York, you're going to have a lot of people wearing them. Like I'm I'm trying to

wearing them. Like I'm I'm trying to think like you go to like raves or like if you go to like big music festivals, this stuff is done all the time. I think

it's something that like would you would I wear it to work? Absolutely not. Would

the average creative [clears throat] maybe.

>> Mhm.

>> Yeah. Like I think middle school, early high school, those are a lot more like kind of the target markets and like the early times. See, I would think that

early times. See, I would think that draws more attention to a pimple.

>> It definitely does, but it's not a pimple anymore.

>> Do they tell people what it is or why they're using it?

>> I think people know. I think people know at this point. And honestly, like I didn't know. And then as soon as I heard

didn't know. And then as soon as I heard it, like I bet I don't know if it's as blatant as like you're going to walk to the go to the airport after this and see them, but like you'll start seeing them pop up in your life. And what I would

have originally attributed to, oh, maybe someone's going to a concert or they're doing some special event later. I'm now

realizing is, oh, no, they're just they're going to the library. They're

going to the supermarket and they just have this cover up on. Um, and it's that simple.

>> Mhm.

>> Do you know how they grew? Was it just Facebook ads?

>> I think retail. I think a lot of retail connections, which is interesting. It's

like you have a lot of these different buyers once you form a connection with them in one category. Like, you know, you have Target, you have Walmart, you have Ulta, you have Sephora. I think so far as a part of Ulta once you get connected with like the health and

wellness buyer or the beauty buyer or the whatever buyer then that's your channel right and so now it's it is let me sell as much as possible and make sure that the product is good but now let me get more products to also sell to you because now I can fill up more

shelves and I talk to them and I say hey what's your worst product on this category in the let's say we're talking supplements like what is your worst are you guys moving a lot of torine today are you guys moving a lot of creatine

today oh we're moving a ton of creatine Okay, like what can we do to get another product in there that's a differentiator? Oh, we've been talking

differentiator? Oh, we've been talking with our buying team and like people want to see creatine with caffeine.

Great.

>> I'm going to work on that. I'll get back to you in 6 months. And you build up those relationships really strong.

>> What if people not put in a gummy yet?

What's left out there?

>> That's the ultimate question. There's

caffeine. There's there's every there's every uh health one, right? Like I don't know if you ever took like the Flintstone gummies growing up, but like that was a staple. I think what you will have to do is find the most annoying

form factor. And like the creatine

form factor. And like the creatine gummies have blown up. I'm sure you've have you seen those.

>> Yeah. Oh, yeah.

>> Those are great because creatine's chalky and it's annoying to take. So

then you see goalie was the original guys of it. And I think they did the apple cider vinegar ones. But so green juices, people want that. I think like maybe like better magnesium gummies, but

these days gummies are >> you're probably late on the gummy curve.

Yeah. At this point >> when I hear $500 million in three years with a gummy, I don't like I'm asking the question to you, what other things could you put in a gummy? But really

what the question is is like should someone just go compete directly with them >> with grins?

>> Yes.

>> I think they have a lot.

>> But like 500 million in three years tells me way more demand than supply. A

little bit of a different angle or the same angle. Just capture a little bit of

same angle. Just capture a little bit of that.

>> Okay. So, the other thing that they've done that I think is really clever is if you go to CVS and you go down the vitamin aisle and you're looking at a bunch of gummies, it is this big plastic

tub with 150 gummies in it and you pick it off, whatever. What they've done, which is really cool, is everything is a travel pack. So, you get this big bag

travel pack. So, you get this big bag and then within that bag, environmentalist cover yours, there's like 50 more little bags.

>> Oh, I hate that so much. [laughter]

Like, as a capitalist, I love it. As

someone who just doesn't want to waste stuff, I hate it.

>> I get it. I get it. But it probably increases consumption so much. Oh, yeah.

Because then you're traveling for a week, you don't want to break that habit and then you have to go grab a bunch.

So, I listened to the founder on a podcast before and he talked about >> how that packaging. No co-manufacturer

would do it for them. Like, they

literally had to go to every single one of these co-ands and have them reinvent one of their processes to figure out how to get I don't know the exact number. I

think it's like seven or eight little gummies into one sache and then put that all those saches into one bigger sache like bigger bag. So like that was that was a lot of the innovation that had to go in there.

>> Yeah. I mean they wouldn't have done that if they didn't think it would work.

>> Agreed. So I think if if the question is what other gummies are going to work just released an immunity one which is different than I guess greens. It's like

you know your vitamin C stuff. I know

that sleep is a massive category that gets talked about a lot these days. I

think that caffeine would be a really interesting one as well.

>> What about custom gummies?

>> Talk to me. Like

>> what about you go to a fancy Shopify site and there's a little form and you say, "What do you want to optimize for?

Sleep creatine health right?"

>> And maybe like on the back end there's like 20 different combinations. That way

there's not like two million combinations of >> supplements and you just order your own custom gummies.

>> I think that makes a ton of sense.

>> Like you're never going to go somewhere else to buy those. I think I think as long as it's easy enough to make or like you have to buy a year's worth or something like that, >> I think that >> the hard part there is the manufacturing, but the marketing sells

itself.

>> Yeah.

>> The two biggest categories in DDC right now are probably the gum the gumification of things >> and uh electrolytes right now. You just

see every electrolyte brand under the sun just >> running up.

>> I still need to make my busy juice and sell that.

>> I think it would do well. I think it would do well. Maybe some kind of combination of that, right? rather than

like like the gummy of Gatorade basically.

>> Yeah, you know, gummy of Gatorade.

>> Like that. The GG.

>> I like that.

>> Yeah.

>> This is reminds me of an idea I've had.

So, one of my hundred 200 domain names is race tattoos.com.

>> Okay.

>> Now, I used to run ultramarathons, trail races, >> and have you ever ran like a trail race?

>> I've done a marathon, not a trail race.

>> Okay. So, even with a marathon, like there's two things you want to kind of keep track of throughout the race. the

elevation profile, >> when am I going uphill, when am I going downhill, and like the the pacing, where are the aid stations? Is this three loops? Is it end to end? Is it out and

loops? Is it end to end? Is it out and back? Is it like a lollipop? Right? They

back? Is it like a lollipop? Right? They

have all different types. And like when you're out there, especially for >> five to 50 hours, like you kind of want to know where am I at, right? So, I

thought it would be cool to kind of do like a permissionless marketing thing where you make these temporary tattoos and there's a bunch of companies that make them, >> but they're it's a temporary tattoo of the elevation profile of your race. And

you could do it for 5ks. It doesn't have to be ultramarathons, right?

>> And then you get there, you anytime you do a race, you get a little packet, a shirt, metal, whatever. Adds

>> uh what's the LMT that you get stuff like that, right? That's great. and you

just pull out a temporary tattoo and you put it on before the race and as you're running you're just like oh here oh I got an a station coming up it's like a Google maps >> I think I think that's great and I feel

like there's so many ways you can play with it too like even if it's like if you're making bespoke ones it can be like all right let me overlay like what I want my nutrition plan to be on it to like add this mile marker I should eat I don't know if you already have guides

that and aids that like do that for you but like it at least gives you a couple like reminders or things like that that you can keep in the back of your mind so Yeah. Well, it's also like it's very

Yeah. Well, it's also like it's very Instagrammable.

>> If you put that on, you're going to post it, [clears throat] right? And they have like semi-permanent tattoos that will last for like weeks or months, right?

And if it were something like that, then it's like it's just free marketing. So,

>> to the race to the >> tattoo company, >> I think it would do super well. I also

think that yeah, like you get it in your in your starter pack or whatever like that. I think another version of this

that. I think another version of this that could be really interesting and this depends on depends on how hard it is to make custom temporary tattoos. So,

hinges a lot on the manufacturing. So,

have you you're you're down in in Dallas. Have you ever been to ACL or

Dallas. Have you ever been to ACL or like any of these big kind of like music festivals things?

>> No.

>> Okay.

>> Austin City Lament.

>> Yeah.

>> No, haven't been. So you basically get this crazy lineup at the beginning of the the thing and and I'm going to connect this idea in a second, but you get this crazy lineup of like here's three days, here's 100 acts, whatever

>> these bands on Thursday, Friday, Saturday.

>> And so then you get in a group chat with your friends and you say who do we want to see? And every single day and these

to see? And every single day and these things literally draw hundreds of thousands of people out to them every single day. What people that are my age

single day. What people that are my age do will be they they get their Friday lineup and they highlight it and they'll make something kind of bespoke and they'll screenshot it and they'll put it as their phone background and then Saturday they'll wake up.

>> You're always referring to it.

>> Yes. And then Saturday they'll wake up and they'll be like here's like I want to go from stage one to stage two to stage three. I want to see this person

stage three. I want to see this person at 7:00 p.m. and this person at 9:00 p.m. So

p.m. So

>> I'm going 100%.

>> Right. So So you're going to the weekend and it's EDC Orlando and it's Friday. We

got this stage, this time, this person.

And it's like you're walking around, it's like, "Oh, where are you going at 700?" It's like, "Let me check."

700?" It's like, "Let me check."

>> Yeah, exactly. And it's like, it's a big event. It's something that like people

event. It's something that like people spend a lot of money on. Tickets for

these things can range from $500 to $1,200, if not more for the full weekend type of event. You're paying for lodging already. You're paying for food. You're

already. You're paying for food. You're

paying for all of this stuff that like if you tell me it's $50 for a bespoke thing cuz girls and everyone's already paying for like, you know, makeup and hair and other stuff. I think it could be a pretty big market.

>> Oh, dude. The question is, do you try to get the people to pay for it or do you get Austin City Limits to pay for it and include it for free?

>> Yeah. I think if it's you get everything, then Austin City Limits will do it. If it's no, I want Chris's lineup

do it. If it's no, I want Chris's lineup and I want like I don't care about Rascal Fats, but I can't miss Zack Bryant and therefore Z Rascal Fats is not on here, but the Zack Bryan at Exfinity Stage at 7 p.m. is, then that

would be a better one. M. Yeah. Cuz when

I first started looking at this idea, I found a dozen companies that will make custom temporary tattoos.

>> How much do they cost?

>> A few bucks.

>> Really?

>> Yeah. It's not bad.

>> That's pretty great.

>> You just send them a design and they're like, you know, 100 piece minimum or whatever. The cheaper it gets.

whatever. The cheaper it gets.

>> But so you don't have to become like a manufacturer. You're just like white

manufacturer. You're just like white labeling it, right? Is drop shipping still a thing? Yes. But unless you have the right tools, you are going to have a really hard time finding success.

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yesterday. The second best time is right now. If we go back to races like there's

now. If we go back to races like there's no company that only puts on one race a year, right? Like generally it's a

year, right? Like generally it's a business. They'll have multiple races a

business. They'll have multiple races a year. And so I would just proactively

year. And so I would just proactively send the race director, you know, if I know they're they have 3,000 spots, I'll send them 3,000 tattoos and say, "Hey, this is free. I thought you'd like it.

Go ahead and put them in every bag or whatever, they're for sure going to come back and buy from you." Assuming people like it, they get good feedback.

>> And putting ads on them would be pretty hilarious.

>> Yeah. I mean, race tattoos.com right there right?

>> Or or I'm thinking like like sell ad space on the tattoo. Nobody nobody has successfully gotten tattoo advertising down the way that it should. So like if

you're selling like you use Gatorades as an example like but you have Gatorade on top of it and [clears throat] you can tell Gatorade, hey I know for a fact, you know, we have a 10% adoption rate of all that we send. New York City Marathon

is 50,000 people running it. We're going

to have 5,000 people with Gatorade temporarily tattooed on their arm for the next week. It's pretty good.

>> Oh. All day,

>> right?

>> Oh man. Especially if you could get like you could get multiple people to pay for it.

>> Yeah.

>> You could get Gatorade to pay for it.

>> You could get the race to pay for it.

>> And then you could even you could upsell like more custom temporary tattoos to the actual participants if they wanted to show it off, right? You could just direct people to your website with a QR

code or something because I'm thinking like if I have all that surface area for people wearing my product, I want to try to sell them something as well.

>> Now, what is that? I don't know, maybe it's just like a a semi-permanent tattoo business where they can say like I ran an ultramarathon, you know, for like 3 months.

>> So, honestly, what I was expecting you to say when you first brought up race tattoos was like a badge of honor type of thing. And like, you know, I'm sure

of thing. And like, you know, I'm sure if I was a bigger runner or like people who are just, you know, the truer of the world, whatever. Like these guys could

world, whatever. Like these guys could probably start checking it off and almost make it like a cool like badge thing. Mhm.

thing. Mhm.

>> I wonder if there's something there where it's like fill it in and you have like the hard part there is, you know, big enough market size and then you make it culturally relevant. So like the idea of you showing up to a race right now with all of your races that you've ever

run tattooed, I'd be like, "Okay, this guy's pretty freaking legit and that's probably a small market size, but if you can make it culturally relevant of like we're going from the LA to the New York City Marathon or we just did the Moab

240, now we're doing the Bigfoot 200."

Like that would be a lot cooler, I think.

>> Yeah. Especially because it's such a passionate audience and they're proud of what they did.

>> It's like a It's like a human bumper sticker, right? Like how many times have

sticker, right? Like how many times have you seen a bumper sticker that says 13.1, >> 26.2?

>> It's like a tattoo version of that.

>> I like that, >> dude. Here's another idea in the same

>> dude. Here's another idea in the same vein. So bike races.

vein. So bike races.

>> Mhm.

>> Right. I read this stat that said road cyclists ingest like so much exhaust from cars.

It more than offsets like the health benefits they get from cycling. It

either more than offsets or it partially offsets to where it's like you net out even.

>> Yeah.

>> Right. Because that's a crazy stat.

>> It's crazy.

>> Yeah.

>> And so I was looking into these things and we all remember the co era the face mask.

>> This guy like in India or somewhere invented like this nostril mask and it's just like a little sticker. You put one there, you put one there and it's a filter, >> right?

>> Yep. Love. So, same distribution idea.

You give it to the races for free.

>> They put them in the bags and cyclists can wear them and then when they pull up to a stoplight and they're behind cars, they just don't open their mouth and it filters out the crap. How well does it work? Nobody knows.

work? Nobody knows.

>> Certainly better than not having anything right?

>> I mean, the reality is with a lot of this stuff, it is problem solution framework. It is fear

framework. It is fear >> solution framework. Like everyone who cycles is healthconscious obviously to start. And so to even just be basically

start. And so to even just be basically say like this will do something and like have some results like don't don't be selling snake oil or whatever like to have some results people are going to buy it.

>> And the nice part is it's subscription and you're going to be able to have these different packs like similar with like hostage >> and you can ship as from coming from an e-commerce background like you could ship it in an envelope for like 54 cents whatever the cost of a stamp is because

they're so flat it's less than an ounce.

>> Do you cycle?

>> Yeah.

>> Do you Okay. I'm just thinking do you breathe through your mouth or do you breathe through your nose?

>> I don't I don't even know. Well, the the reason I ask is because I'm wondering something that's already pretty popular is a lot of this mouth tape for sleeping. Yeah. So, you think of like

sleeping. Yeah. So, you think of like hostage tape, think of a couple other companies like that. Could you just do the mouth tape for cycling? Like, can

you take the same exact product and and rather than putting somebody sleeping on it, just put somebody cycling and then cuz like your nose is already natural filter. Yeah. Yeah.

filter. Yeah. Yeah.

>> And so if people have the tendency and listen >> not medical advice, consult your doctor, but like if people already have the tendency to breathe through their mouth, however, people can breathe through their nose and it is just a habit that

needs to be formed and you can say your nose is a natural filtration device, whatever.

>> Then I think it would be interesting to sell bike tape right over your mouth.

>> Well, it doesn't just have to be cycling either. like I don't remember but I've

either. like I don't remember but I've heard like in running to optimize your breathing or endurance or whatever you like inhale through your mouth and exhale through your mouth something like that and that's like common knowledge

right for runners >> clearly I'm not a runner because I don't remember what that knowledge is but >> if you were to just sell like the mouth tape for that like a a functional mouth tape for a different purpose

>> that might not work five or 10 years ago before the mouth tape company but now that people are accustomed to seeing the ads seeing that it's normal it's like oh this is just for running this is to me remember to run better, therefore I'll have more endurance and I'll get a

better time.

>> Yeah, theoretically, >> I think it makes a lot of sense. I think

also the the fear part, there's the there's a benefit part of I'm going to be a better athlete out of this, which is like aspirational, sell that vision, whatever. Then there's [clears throat]

whatever. Then there's [clears throat] the don't you want to actually make sure you're not breathing in toxic stuff, especially when you are breathing the most that you ever do in any given day.

And I feel like that would sell really well.

>> Yeah. Yeah. with the nostril things. I

love that it's already a product cuz it's right now it's being marketed as like a a slimmer alternative to the face mask right?

>> You just license that thing, put it in different packaging.

>> There's I think a big trend in a lot of products around there around filtration, filtration of water, filtration of air, filtration of all the dust that's in your vents, which I guess is the air part of it. Big money industry, very big

money. And so I think what you can do is

money. And so I think what you can do is try to figure out what are the other categories that you can put that in. I

love the filtration of air for cyclists, filtration of air for athletes, filtration of water. I don't really know. Like you see a lot of like the

know. Like you see a lot of like the shower head stuff popping up right now, a lot of faucet stuff, a lot of harsh chemicals that like there's probably a lot of money to be made in that space just with like more niche positioning.

>> Yeah, I know that they have like filtered showerheads, right?

>> What are those filters supposed to be removing?

>> Chloride.

>> Chloride. Yeah. Heavy metals. Uh, this

is what they tell me, but it's it's heavy metals. It's a lot of like I don't

heavy metals. It's a lot of like I don't know if it's bacteria. I don't know what what exactly it is, but it's stuff that impacts your skin and your hair. Like

the value prop that you see on a lot of the ads is better, fuller hair, cleaner, healthier skin, all that stuff.

>> Do they have one for microplastics?

Like a a shower head to filter out microplastics?

>> No, but that would be interesting.

Somebody just launched a company that audits your environment. Have you heard about this? Do you know what I'm talking

about this? Do you know what I'm talking about at all?

>> It's like >> I haven't heard of the specific company you're thinking of, but I'm familiar with the concept with the industry.

>> So I think like might be wrong about this. Somebody will come to your house

this. Somebody will come to your house or somebody will do a Zoom call around your house and they'll say, "Show me how you cook." Y and you'll you'll show them

you cook." Y and you'll you'll show them a not stainless steel pan. They'll be

like, "Okay, check mark." Yeah, exactly.

>> Oh, you hate your kids. [laughter]

>> They'll be like, "All right, like bring me up to your event. All right, I see some dust over there. Like see your filter or whatever." It is basically like a I don't know if it's an at cost or a free consultation to then upsell all these product enhancements whether

it's a lighting in your ceilings or the shower drain or whatever the hell it is right and so to your point on filtering out microplastics I think this initial consulting service based business is

really great to capture a large audience >> and then as far as filtering out microplastics is probably probably a new microwave or like it's probably like not heating the plastic or like removing like it's a hard

>> it's a forward a holistic problem. I

think >> you know >> yeah I feel like with those home audits people would pay for that like they would pay to be upsold other products.

>> So this is where like you and I might have talked about this in the past.

Merrick Health. Do you remember this at all? We might have not talked about it.

all? We might have not talked about it.

>> Merrick Health. Maris Health something like that. It is a company that will do

like that. It is a company that will do a relatively low cost blood test >> because for them the blood test is like all right we're going to get you in the door and we're going to be like the the pioneers of data. like we're going to be

very consultative and you're going to trust us and then once you get the blood test back it's like Chris you're actually really low on iron and vitamin D and like you're pretty deficient in these other five categories.

>> We can put you on a program that's custom and bespoke to you and buy all the gummies and vitamins through us directly and just stay on subscription and then we'll test your blood again in 6 months and you'll see if we've improved anything. And that's a really

improved anything. And that's a really good way to do it because you get this consultative these people are smart approach and then it's well you just gave me the problem now give me the solution.

>> And I think for the what's wrong with my environment there's like you can change out iridescent light bulbs like I'm currently in my apartment right now just going through all that phase of doing like floor up lighting and like trying

to make it a softer space at night and like I watched a bunch of these YouTube videos and kind of hacked it together.

But if there's somebody that I could call instantly and I'm like, "Hey, here's my apartment. Like, give me five lamps and like where to put them in and like set up my Alexa for me." Like, that would be a great service. And I think that you could do that for your

environment for health products.

>> Yeah. Have you heard of Function Health?

>> Yes. Yeah. They're they're big. You

can't use them in uh New York City, though.

>> Really?

>> Yeah. I think it's I think there's some legal thing there.

>> Okay. I I'm using them.

>> You like it?

>> Yeah. I mean, it's like I think it's like six or 800 bucks a year >> and you that includes two blood tests.

>> It seems like a no-brainer.

>> Yeah. And you just go to like a lab corp or whatever and you get like 12 vials of blood drawn and two weeks later they give you your testosterone, your blood sugar like >> oh, it's like 103 different biomarkers, right?

>> What I did with that is tediously screenshotted every single result. Yeah.

>> And it was like green, yellow, red. It's

got beautiful design. It's like an Airbnb feel. And then I just uploaded it

Airbnb feel. And then I just uploaded it to a Chad GPT project and I was like, "Fix me." And now I take pills every

"Fix me." And now I take pills every night like a boomer, right? No offense

to add that up. [laughter]

>> Do your uh do your new uh biomarkers look better?

>> I haven't taken the second one yet.

Okay.

>> It's been like 3 months. I'm going to get another one in 3 months. I take fish oil. I take niacin. I take a vitamin B

oil. I take niacin. I take a vitamin B complex.

>> And like I just think it's so funny when people start like taking pills and they're like, "Dude, I just feel so much better. I just feel so it's like do you?

better. I just feel so it's like do you?

>> It's cheap insurance.

>> I just I've never had a period in my life where like I I just I always feel good. I was 260 lbs and I felt good.

good. I was 260 lbs and I felt good.

Like I just don't know. It's all

confirmation bias, right?

>> I think there's so much there's a personality type that is super optimize heavy.

>> Yeah.

>> And as a result of that, it makes it such that you actually never feel good because you can always be doing a little bit better. And I actually think this is

bit better. And I actually think this is maybe a side tangent that's not as business related, but like the good that probably a lot of the Huberman and Fairest stuff of the world has done can

probably also be pretty offset by the person who actually feels worse the next day because they got 7 hours and 55 minutes of sleep versus the exact, you know, eight and a half hours that they were regimented to get or

[clears throat] like, you know, god forbid they looked at their phone within an hour of going to sleep. Like at a grant at a high level, I think all of this advice is actually very helpful and directionally correct.

>> But like when you are obsessed with getting the perfect thing, whether it's the perfect level of fish oil in your bloodstream or like the perfect weight on the scale or whatever, you're actually never going to feel good no matter what.

>> And so I think that it's just like a mindset shift honestly for a lot of it.

Like the the pills do very little, especially with these supplements.

>> Yeah. And really the only thing that makes me feel like really good is caffeine.

>> Everything else is just secondary. I I

will say I think I think creatine does a little bit for me at the gym.

>> I need to do it. I need to take it.

>> I think I think there's like the meme of like what you think you're going to feel like when you have creatine and it's like the it's like an Instagram video of everyone using those fake glass bottles.

It's like you toss me a beer just smashes in his hand. Uh like the reality is you'll probably get one or two more reps on everything in the gym.

>> Okay, >> that's kind of it. And that's if you're consistent with it, but it's like very tiny gains.

>> Yeah. I was listening to another podcast and they said that of the top three bestselling creatine gummies on Amazon, >> two of them had zero creatine.

>> Yep.

>> Zero. And so what Subode does is they'll test everything.

>> They'll they'll take it into a lab.

Unbiased third party. They're not like they strategically don't have affiliate links. Like they're unbi like they

links. Like they're unbi like they charge for the app. That's how they make money, right? Because they know they

money, right? Because they know they have to, right? And be unbiased.

>> Quick question. What if there were a private community out there of people that were building businesses based on this podcast? Well, I just made it and

this podcast? Well, I just made it and it's only for business starters and business builders. It's called TK owners

business builders. It's called TK owners and it's basically like having me and 100 other business geniuses as your business partner. Also, there's going to

business partner. Also, there's going to be exclusive new trends, growth hacks, business ideas, and a database of everything I've ever talked about.

You'll find thousands of startup case studies. You'll have weekly ask me

studies. You'll have weekly ask me anythings with me while I'll answer your questions directly. You can join now at

questions directly. You can join now at tkowners.com, link in the show notes. So

you can go use the app and see like, oh, like I need to take these creatine gummies. Oh, these might be good, but

gummies. Oh, these might be good, but they haven't been tested yet. Oh, these

I thought that's a really interesting business model. And I'm wondering what

business model. And I'm wondering what else you could do that with.

>> I'm trying to think. It's like it's almost like giving like you're selling trust, right? And so I'm thinking like

trust, right? And so I'm thinking like it's like the Michelin Michelin stars of rating or like the IMDb, which if that was actually relevant or the Rotten Tomatoes whatever >> of food. I don't even think you need that in a different category like or I

guess you do for the sake of like thinking of new business ideas but like there's Crea Pure is the name of the brand that everyone goes to and you

almost want to see their manufacturing brand on their logo and you see like David's protein butch bought I forget.

Do you remember what I'm talking about like the EPG thing?

>> No, >> they bought like whatever protein allows them to have like this crazy caloric difference.

>> Oh, I did hear about that.

>> Manu I don't think it's EPG. It's just

something like like the David Bar.

>> Yeah, exactly. I think finding like a trusted third party of one specific thing, whether that's creatine, whether that's the bioavailability of a certain supplement, I think makes sense. I know

that there's another company out there called Seed Oil Scout.

>> I've heard of that.

>> You've heard of them? Yeah. So, they

will do like all of the restaurants in New York City and show you the ones that do not use CO >> and they have like a Yelp like a directory for >> Exactly. So, I think you have to find

>> Exactly. So, I think you have to find something that people really care about.

Like probably a good one based on an earlier conversation would be like filtration and like air quality or something like that. Like can you have someone test air quality at every Marriott across America and that

therefore you're staying in hotels that like only actually are sanitary and like follow the code or something like that?

>> What if you did like a subco for popular snacks or foods for their their caloric contents or their ingredients? Right.

So, I I love uh Old Trapper beef jerky >> and they have this it's like teriyak and they have these medallions and they're really good and I was eating them last summer like a ton and they were like I think they were like 10 calories per

medallion and I was just crushing them, right? But then I looked at the the

right? But then I looked at the the weight and it was like one medallion was like 28 grams which is an ounce and when I did the math on like the the nutritional facts differently it was off

by 100 uh%. Right? So basically I I just divided by the weight of the serving size or something.

>> They were 20 calories per.

>> Yeah.

>> Right. And I think it was because they were like 14 pieces for 140 calories, but when you looked at the weight, it was actually 280 calories. And I was like, >> this is like a massive brand. These are

sold in every gas station, every 100%. And it's just because I happen to

100%. And it's just because I happen to do the math.

>> It's got to be wrong everywhere.

>> I don't know how it works with some of these companies. You'd think that they

these companies. You'd think that they would be more conscious of it so that way they don't get in trouble with like the FDA or whoever monitors this type of stuff. I can tell you right now for the

stuff. I can tell you right now for the supplement space, it is like it is probably the one thing that you can get away with so much as you kind of just pointed out with subs. I mean, at the end of the day, like people are going to

eat that beef jerky because they like it tastes good and it fills them up, whatever.

>> No one is taking supplements because >> they taste I guess the gummies maybe, but like because they taste good and because it like fills them up necessarily. you're only doing it

necessarily. you're only doing it because you want the desired outcome that you think that this will make you more healthy. And so if it's not

more healthy. And so if it's not accomplishing that goal, the efficacy is just really important for this type of stuff.

>> Well, I found out the same thing when I was trying to make my busy juice drink.

I was trying to buy lemon powder >> and I learned by accident that this lemon powder I had been using for mine, it was supposed to be pure 100% lemon.

That's what the it showed. But it wasn't at all. It was like crystallized. And I

at all. It was like crystallized. And I

talked to this chemist and he's like, "If it's crystallized, they've added these sweeteners." I was like, "This

these sweeteners." I was like, "This should not be sweet at all." And it was.

I'm like, >> very tart. Is that right line? Like,

isn't anyone looking at this? And then

when I was doing keto for like 6 months, I had like these this product from Trader Joe's >> and it was like two net carbs and like I was testing my blood for ketones and it

was outright wrong. So, it's like, okay, the three times that I've actually held the, you know, the nutritional value feat to the fire.

>> Yeah. That's crazy.

>> They were all wrong.

>> Yeah. So, just so a food a a CPG version of subs.

>> Yes. All you need is a it's called a bomb calerimeter. It's like this little

bomb calerimeter. It's like this little device that anyone can buy where you you take food, you grind it up, you dehydrate it to get all the water content out, >> and then you put it in like a pill form and you burn it.

>> And the machine measures how much energy is emitted from burning it. That's the

calories. Those are the calories, right?

>> That's cool.

>> And however many heat calories are emitted, that's how many calories that that food had. So you had to get you got to basically take a slice of pizza, you let it dry 100%, blend it up, put it in

a pill form, and then you light it on fire in this enclosed space, and it measures how much energy is coming out.

>> Oh, that's super cool. I have no idea.

>> You would basically take like a box of Cheezits or something, and you would do all that, and then you'd say, "All right, we can affirm that this lot number has actually this many calories.

The carbs are this much. The fats are this much." And so,

this much." And so, >> you know, a lot of these foods we eat every single day. Like I'll eat a Quest bar one to two times a day, the same thing.

>> And it could be completely wrong and it could be having a completely detrimental effect on my body and I have no idea.

>> That's really interesting. Eat whole

foods I think is the eat whole foods and uh develop subs for CPG.

>> There you go. That I think there could be a business there.

>> Especially if there's just like a verified like I think you have to basically How do you do it though?

Because I think you have to make a marketing campaign that your nutritional labels are lying to you. Yeah. and

basically an attack on the government and the FDA and whoever makes that kind of stuff and says if you want the real information come here and basically start with a whole like actually audited version of the app.

>> Wow, that could spread so easily with short video.

>> Yeah, I like that.

>> All right, what's your idea?

>> All right, how much time we have? All

right, we got we got three minutes. Let

me You're going to get an elevator pitch and if we want to do a deep dive on this later, we can.

>> So, you're in New York right now. There

are a ton of bathous here and one that has recently popped up that is taking over New York City and if you're in your 20s and 30s like you've probably heard about it because it's a big like social

wellness thing is Other Ship. Other ship

is crushing it. They are uh this like sauna cold plunge steam room type. I

don't have seen it steam rooms but really cool novel experience and they took this you know however many year old hundreds of year old concept hot and cold and they made it trendy and cool.

So, there's another concept that is hundreds of years old or or has been around for a while that has gotten a little bit trendier, but honestly hasn't had like a good brand dominate it, and

that's silent meditation retreats.

>> And so, we've seen it pop up more in the last, I don't know, tech era of like the last 15 years, whatever, of like these tech gurus, they're going away for 3 days, 5 days, 7 days, whatever. They're

not talking to anybody, no phones, disconnected from technology. They come

back, they were healed, they had a realization about themselves, whatever.

But if I asked anybody, you know, what what sign of meditation or dishi did you do? There is not a

do? There is not a >> there's no brand.

>> There's no brand. There's not a clear one thing. And maybe that's because the

one thing. And maybe that's because the market's not big enough. Maybe that's

because the version of it is not accessible enough yet. Whatever that

looks like, but like you know, people made tiny houses trendy via like getaway. They've made cold plunges and

getaway. They've made cold plunges and sauna trendy from other ship. And so

there's a lot of ways that I think that you can make this concept trendy. And a

lot of it probably comes down to, you know, make it more accessible. You

didn't do a seven-day silent meditation retreat. You did a 48 hour silent

retreat. You did a 48 hour silent meditation retreat >> or four hours or like an afternoon, honestly.

>> Yeah. Yeah, probably. And I think so then maybe maybe you can do it within a place, right? Like, hey, I'm going here

place, right? Like, hey, I'm going here on a Thursday night to just clear my thoughts and not think about anything like shut the world out. They take my phone in the beginning or whatever. Four

hours is actually probably the smarter version. I didn't think about that. I

version. I didn't think about that. I

was going to say do it, you know, within a 90-minute drive of a city. To your

point, do it in the city. Like New York City is the loudest, most busy place on the freaking planet or at least in the US. And if you can walk in and reliably

US. And if you can walk in and reliably say, "I'm going to give you this. I'm

going to give you my phone." Maybe

there's like some distress protocol and then it's 4 hours sitting at a freaking wall and like you're in a distractionree environment where you're like, "Why do you do that in your living room?" It's

like I've got my TV, my Kindle, my iPad, my laptop, my phone. And so like this forces me to be present.

>> What do you think? I love it. And kind

of like people taking supplements saying, "I feel so much better." They're

going to come out of there being like, "That was incredible."

>> Yep.

>> I changed my life.

>> Yep. And it's going to spread and it's going to be I've got a lot to think about. I'm going to go into chamber.

about. I'm going to go into chamber.

Whatever you want to brand it as. I

think it could do really well.

>> Call it quiet place.

>> Quiet place.

>> Like the movie.

>> Yeah, I was going to say quick lawsuit and then we're right back.

>> That's fine. That's fine.

>> That's a good one. You wouldn't need a lot of space. It could be like a very small room.

>> I think it could be a very small room.

You could probably have two versions.

You could probably have like like a phone booth, like a Weberwork phone booth kind of setup almost where it's like, "All right, I'm I'm here." And

then you could probably have a group room where it's like you walk in and I've talked to some people who have done these things and some of it's like, you know, they walk in a circle for 4 hours or like they sit on a pillow and they

look at the wall, but like the point is it is intentionally pretty unstructured and unguided. Yeah. And I would say for

and unguided. Yeah. And I would say for something like other ship, other ship got a lot of notoriety because they'll do like these classes and they'll do these breath work classes. And so

there's probably a world where you can mix breath work into it. There's

probably a world where like you can work with somebody on like setting intentions going into it or like get a prompt to reflect on or like there's a coaching element to it. Like there's probably a lot of like upsells and like flavors of it. Yeah. But I think that you could

it. Yeah. But I think that you could also sell like to your point like could you sell a two-hour slot for 120 bucks?

Would people pay that? I don't know. But

like you're basically selling uh the ability to get away from all distractions.

>> I bet people would pay it. I love it, man.

>> Yeah. Thank you.

>> Cool.

>> All right.